Gespräche mit Goethe

Gespräche mit Goethe[BOOKS] ✪ Gespräche mit Goethe Author Johann Peter Eckermann – Eckermanns »Gespräche mit Goethe« sind ein Werk von fast unabsehbarer Wirkung eminent wichtig für das Verständnis von Goethes Werk und Persönlichkeit ein Monument seines Nachruhms In gewisser We Eckermanns »Gespräche mit Goethe« sind ein Werk von fast unabsehbarer Wirkung eminent wichtig für das Verständnis von Goethes Werk und Persönlichkeit ein Monument seines Nachruhms In gewisser Weise gelten sie als eigenes Werk unseres größten Dichters Schon als Eckermann völlig verarmt im Jahre starb setzte die Legendenbildung ein »Ich hatte zuvor noch einmal« schrieb ein Zeitzeuge »in das stille unentstellte Antlitz geblickt auf welchem Goethes Gespräche mit PDF \ Flammenaugen so oft geruht hatten« Lange Zeit hat man in Eckermann ausschließlich das reine Medium seines Meisters gesehen und dessen Äußerungen in den »Gesprächen« als authentisch zitiert Aber sie sind mehr spiegeln auch und nicht zuletzt den Kampf dieses »Mediums« um ein eigenständiges Werk Die Ausgabe bietet den vollständigen Text nach den Erstausgaben und wertet Eckermanns Vorarbeiten Fassungen Fragmente und Pläne Tagebücher und Korrespondenzen aus Alle Texte werden durch einen umfangreichen Kommentar erschlossen. It is a delightful book I cannot help giving this book full five stars This feels weird though to give such books starsI like every page of the book Right at the beginning Eckermann writes about his impoverished childhood and his realization that he is gifted Later in the Book we learn how he gets in touch with Goethe The book is written in the form of journal entries He meets Goethe often and they talk about other writers books and so forth These are indeed delightful moments Eckermann's fascination with Goethe is absolute He sees a lot in him; sometimes it feels like Goethe resides inside himIt is also wonderful to read about Jena Weimar and such small historical towns No matter where one lives in the world one is drawn to the world that the writer describes I feel nostalgic about the place and those meetings where the young meet the established Eckermann's meetings with Goethe are full of warmth I loved listening to their talksI am also inclined to read a bit about Goethe after I finished reading this book Although he is known for his love for women there is enough about him in his own words and in the words of others which indicate his same sex leanings Throughout his life even though he loved women he never gave himself to anyone – including his first love However he always had great male friends For instance the Duke of Weimar was really enchanted with him and he with the Duke They would spend a lot of time together hunting Their bonding was so strong that it had annoyed the ministers in the Duke's staff as if the young poet might taint their Duke He lived the better part of his life in Weimar against the wishes of his father I wonder if anyone researched about his male friends such as the Duke of WeimarHowever I am not at all suggesting that Goethe relationship with Eckermann was homosexual not at all It is very clear that Eckermann admires Goethe for his work He probably feels complete in Goethe's company What fascinates me about the book is how Goethe emerges in the book For instance it is interesting to note that Goethe was a huge admirer of Winkelmann and very often in the book he speaks very highly of Lord Byron In fact Byron had met Goethe on several occasions As for Winkelmann after living in Italy for several years when he travelled back to Germany Goethe as a young man was on cloud nine and waited for him like a lover that is how Walter Pater wrote about Goethe and Winkelmann in his wonderful book 'The Renaissance'The book is written in a wonderful language One thing I would like to do soon is to go and see Weimar I admire Eckermann's sensibility The book is as much about Goethe as it is about Eckermann Admiring someone else for his her talent is very often about the admirer It's hard to say what's so great about Goethe One could list all the arts and sciences that he contributed to but looking honestly at those contributions none seems to have really remained of fruitful interest to our time at least not here in the US Perhaps the way his influence is currently most felt here is through Waldorf schools which are based on Rudolph Steiner's theories which were elaborations of Goethe's But while Waldorf schools seem to do a great job of helping kids turn into good human beings one can't say they're a major cultural force Faust? I rarely see references to it; selling one's soul to the devil in exchange for pleasure isn't of much concern to a culture that tends to confound pleasure with nearness to God Goethe himself believed that his theories about color would be of most lasting value to the world but these theories seem to be simply irrelevant nowadays though curiously not disproved And yet Goethe was a great man This will be as clear as a vast and cloudless sky to anyone who reads the conversations that he had with and that were diligently recorded by his protege and friend Johann Eckermann The first sign of Goethe's greatness is his enormous capacity to love and attentively notice the works and people whom he perceives as excellent Goethe pays homage to writers Schiller Lord Byron Voltaire many others visual artists most of whom aren't well known now statesmen the local Duke whom he loved and served and bafflingly but especially Napoleon and scientists Humboldt others Goethe is sharp in rebuking anyone who suggests that he is or that anyone but a thoroughly crazy and defective artist could be free from influences ie a self made man Goethe strongly asserts that every act is the result of many influences and the finer the act the finer the art the richly and deeply was it influenced The finest act the finest art is indeed hardly attributable to the person who did made it at all but rather becomes an expression of something superhuman which he calls the daemonic spirit This is all discussed with enormous playfulness geniality and modesty the second third and fourth signs of Goethe's greatness Also there are lots of contradictions here in Goethe's thinking which he is aware of but doesn't seem to mind terribly sign of greatness #5 The sixth sign of Goethe's greatness is his belief in what must be called for lack of a precise word magic It seems that Goethe didn't commit to any particular religion nor did he make up one of his own yet he certainly wasn't a materialist I think he didn't see a reason to codify or even to discuss at any length what for him was a living experience He simply took pleasure in his sense of the divine in nature and rejoiced in others' ability to do so too Thankfully this divine in nature never becomes overwrought or forced but always feels uite simple and even somewhat peculiar as it should given the differences between the land from which he arose and that of most readers The seventh sign of Goethe's greatness is that he could become hilariously surly when discussing his detractors but he preferred and usually attained serenity I especially enjoyed his comments when asked why he didn't help defend Germany during the Napoleonic wars This is clearly a sour subject for Goethe but he doesn't try to weasel out of it He says that he did than enough for his country by writing great poems and that further a great poet like himself is a citizen of the world so can bear no enmity toward other nations especially a nation as cultured as France This surely unpopular explanation for his pacifism is actually scoffed at in an editorial footnote in my edition of Conversations and might still be controversial today Also relevant to today are Goethe's criteria for judging art though we would apply to movies his thoughts about theater and to pop music his thoughts about poetry Goethe again with many contradictions loved what was excellent genuine and uplifting He was the first to distinguish classical and romantic art I call the classic healthy and the romantic sickly Most modern productions are romantic not because they are new but because they are weak morbid and sickly And the antiue is classic not because it is old but because it is strong fresh joyous and healthy But later Classic and romanticare eually good the only point is to use these forms with judgment and to be capable of excellence you can be absurd in both and then one is as worthless as the other Eighth sign of greatness developed this fascinating trope but was unenslaved by it So there are my eight signs of Goethe's greatness; I'm sure a perceptive reader could add to the list Conversations with Goethe is worth the occasional minor eye glaze caused by many references to people most of us won't have heard of It's a lively encounter with a great man in the last year of his long deep life Perhaps his views will see a resurgence in popularity someday That would not be a bad thing for any of us Free download available at Project Gutenberg If you are interested in the history and culture of Goethe's time 1749 1832 as I am this is well worth reading Having read some of Goethe's works it was interesting to find out about his plans intentions and influencesWhat does make this an occasionally uncomfortable read is the very uneven relationship between Eckermann and Goethe After having known each other for three months having spent most of that time apart and not communicating Goethe asks Eckermann to stay in Weimar not just for a while but for his whole life And Eckermann accepts because as long as he can have Goethe he'll be happyGoethe continues to tell Eckermann what he should and shouldn't do and Eckermann continues to idolize Goethe and fail to see even one tiny flaw in him They don't ever come close to connecting as euals Also despite Eckermann's effort to portray Goethe in the most flattering light possible Goethe comes across as uite conceited and full of himself at times Goethe hated spectacles so much that he went out of his way not to speak to bespectacled people Also you know Harold Bloom's theory of the anxiety of influence? What about Thomas Kuhn's theory of the structure of scientific revolutions? Yep Goethe came up with both of those and they're right here in this book Goethe was one of the most famous and greatest writers who ever lived and this incredible book is an insight into his life and thoughts at an old age one where he was nonetheless fully aware and writing the second part of Faust The book contains the memories of conversations between Goethe and Eckermann who was assisting him in various ways with his legacy In the book Goethe discusses a wide variety of topics from literature to science and comes across as probably the most elevated and cultured person whom I have ever encounteredVirtually every page is filled with Goethe's insight and genius which is of the highest order to use a phrase perhaps he would use It's hard to say exactly what my favorite parts were his comments on other authors are always brilliant his advice to other writers his comments on his prior works his discussions about science and his theories of color but perhaps most remarkable was his discussion of his ongoing progress on the second part of Faust which took him six years to write I also particularly liked the various excursions he took with Eckermann whether to neighboring towns or up into the mountains It also portrays this incredible literary world which frankly filled me with pangs of jealousy particularly the various homages he receives from other artists most notable a chest full of literary goodies from the great artist David in France The various Ambassadors and German royalty that visit as well as other famous writers and artists and the dinner parties and concert parties they hold describe a world that seems unfathomable in its richness The near constant discussion of theater which has odd similarities to how we talk about movies is also fascinating and his advice to dramatists as well as poets should also be consideredConcepts such as elevated and cultured and highest order have been shot down in our modernist era and yet here you have Goethe one of the greatest writers of all time describing literature and the world in that sense I felt while reading this that this moment in time and place was the true pinnacle of civilization and everything has been downhill since like some would say classical music after Beethoven Sometimes the book made me realize just how human great artists are and yet other parts were so rich and profound I felt this enormous gulf between myself and GoetheI recommend this book for anyone especially writers of any sort and people involved in the theater I would recommend reading both parts of Faust and probably some of his other works beforehand I had only read Wilhelm Meister but The Sorrows of Young Werther is mentioned freuently as are many of his poems dramas Tasso and Iphigenia and other works You might want to read some Schiller as well Robbers in particular Lord Byron is a big favorite of Goethe He says a truly cultured person has read the Greeks and some of the Romans and Shakespeare and MoliereThis was a great book to read towards the end of the Powys project Goethe is truly a giant and Faust is part of Columbia's core curriculum although it wasn't when I was there He had a wide range of interests from literature in all its forms poetry drama and novels and science he was a well known botanist and was interested in the science of colors The book had a lot of personal meaning for me; he was someone who I truly admire and hope to emulate in the remainder of my life Having such a direct insight into someone so brilliant and incredible is a treat Boswell's Life of Johnson is not uite at the same level how rare it is that we get to sit at the table of the Muses and hear what they have to say and think I am possibly in agreement with Nietzsche that this is the greatest book ever published in the German language I say this for a number of reasons1 German is the language of the Bildungsroman and how could there be any better Bildung than one conducted by Goethe himself?2 On the flip side of this euation Eckermann’s worship of Goethe produces a master student relationship unlike anything else in Western literature The pure positivity emanating from this book is a source of boundless creative energy3 It is a masterpiece of aesthetics as it is not merely the work of a single aesthete offering opinions nor of two aesthetes debating but of a combination of inspired conversation and hard contemplation Eckermann seriously believes in this stuff and through his seriousness he convinces you to believe in it too4 Compared to German classics like The Magic Mountain which are unspeakably deep but also grandilouent this is a book that speaks to the novice and the expert alike It introduces you to the idea of Germany and Europe through straightforward table talk while digging in as deep as any historian of thought would be willing to goSome of what Goethe says is actually absurd or self contradictory but when he is not contradicting himself he is offering brilliant insights In a single evening of chatting with Eckermann Goethe prophesied that America would build the Panama Canal England would come to own the Suez Canal and Germany would eventually have a Rhine—Danube canal On another evening he transformed the concept of occasional poetry from an act performed in court for a patron to a tribute to the ultimate patron Nature He performs these daily marvels with joy and cheer It is a book you can drink from like a well Worth reading but certainly not a top book What a strange uneven relationship Eckermann had with the God of German literature Goethe is solidly present of course strong and manipulative Eckermann is all devotion Much about literature and art what did you expect Goethe was uite obsessive about his own color theory At the end there's a strong focus on the editing of his biographical writings and beueathed works; Goethe never stopped bullying Eckermann around This is the book Nietzsche called the best book in the German language the Conversations with Goethe of Eckermann three books that Eckermann compiled from notes and diaries detailing their almost daily discussions during the last few years of Goethe's life For me the first two books out of three are too direct too fawning Eckermann was clearly loving Goethe and some of that feeling is reciprocated Goethe complains about how some contemporary writer is bad in this or that way then Eckermann comes up with an example of how Goethe did that thing much better in one of his plays and then both vehemently agree for a page or twoYou have to see it this way a young self taught guy from a poor background who has never finished any schooling or higher degree who yearns for a career in the arts meets a famous man at the end of his life a man whose time in the mainstream is over who is maybe yearning for some attention from the younger German generations The third book is much better written a few years after Goethe's death there's distance between Eckermann and Goethe which leads to a cooler description of what was going on The first two books spend so much time on Eckermann and Goethe agreeing that I'm surprised there's no slash fiction out thereSome notes Goethe's theory of color keeps on appearing over and over again tl;dr light doesn't consist of all colors but colors appear when darkness and light mix Goethe was very angry that the crowning achievement of his life was being ignored by the mainstream There are some fun implications for philosophy of science and general crank ism in there A good theory doesn't explain phenomena it predicts them; when Goethe's theory's predictions failed he explained these failures away by saying that the eye is subjective it wants to see what it sees Only a few pages later he complains about how no one wants to let go of Newton's theory of color but he couldn't do that with his own theory Goethe Kunstwerk des Lebens states that Goethe was gifted a prism which would have dispelled his theory but there's not a word about it here The other scientific research for example into the metamorphosis of plants worked out better his methods and concepts like homology vs analogy are still in use It's interesting how often Lord Byron appears nowadays probably known as the father of Ada Lovelace one of the pioneers of computing Goethe was immensely impressed with Byron and he discusses Byron's successes and failures over and over again the most discussed artist here Schiller appears often too for obvious reasons I was easily lost in discussions between Eckermann and Goethe about their contemporary literature much of which has been forgotten have you ever read anything by August Hagen? Or August von Kotzebue Friedrich August Wolf Johann Gottfried Herder St Schütze and many similar ones? Me neither You get a making of of Faust 2 which Goethe finished with Eckermann's help in the last few years of his life including some insights into what Goethe thought about certain elements of the play there's no specific symbolism behind the names of the characters Baucis and Philemon just that their situation is vaguely similar to the characters in Ovid's writing or how much Goethe owed to the Greeks he kept on returning to Greek drama his entire life It's also interesting how extremely confident Goethe was Sometimes that worked out immensely in his favor you can't just write that many poems plays novels and publish in several sciences without believing in what you're doing In other times it didn't help it doesn't look like he could admit errors theory of colors again I wish I could be this much into my own work lots and lots of interesting thoughts on arts and on his work the role of Germany too much to fit in here Goethe spent his whole life trying to perfect his life his outlook and his personality this gave me the first insight into why he's such a revered personality in Germany and why Nietzsche loved him so much Goethe was someone who never stopped improving himself Goethe's personal philosophy of life and religion still has a lot to offerAnyway once you get past all the fawning there are some extremely interesting thoughts and concept to be found here and I really got to understand why Goethe is still such a towering figure in German culture To begin after 79 pages I held a conference with myself and elected not to finish Conversations of Goethe And after sleeping on my decision nothing changedJohann Wolfgang von Goethe poet dramatist novelist translator scientist and musician is recognized as the last universal genius of the West and I looked very much forward to getting to know him via being in his presence as uips about the book promised This did not prove to be the case as though Goethe's assistant Johann Peter Eckermann took detailed notes of his meetings with Goethe over a nine year period from 1823 to Goethe's death in 1832 and then worked assiduously over a twelve year period to transcribe them into the text of the book his nineteenth century style of writing unfortunately struck me as dry Many individuals some of major importance some not are also present at times during Eckermann's meetings with Goethe which range in duration from a few minutes to almost an entire day many of whom did not actually interact with Goethe Eckermann pointing out that Goethe was a very good listener This complicated my effort to gain insight into Goethe as a person and to learn what he thought about various subjects from countries to writing styles to politics etc At Page 79 not uite twenty five percent of the book I asked myself if I was learning much about Goethe and the answer was not a great deal Moreover I was not enjoying the book and the small font used by the publisher added to the struggle to look forward to the next page With so many books available that both entertain and educate and so little time to read them all I decided that discretion was indeed the better part of valor especially as I approach my seventy fifth birthday next monthI do want to add that from the introduction Johann Peter Eckermann was a most admirable person and scholar Born into a poor family he did not receive the benefits of much formal education and through hard work turned himself into an educated man and poet And having studied German literature and philosophy and decided that his hero was Goethe Johann Peter's devotion to Goethe in assisting him to complete certain works and order others before his death was truly admirable when the amount of self sacrifice on his part is taken into consideration After meeting Eckermann and deciding that his talents were well suited to assisting him Goethe did forward Johann Peter's book of poems to a publisher with the recommendation that they be published which occurred Thereafter however during the next nine years they worked together Goethe did not pay Eckermann Johann Peter subsisting on tutoring lessons he gave Only one year before his death did Goethe draw up a contract that made Eckermann the editor of his completed works with a small percentage of the royalties to come from their publication Because of his poor economic conditions Eckermann delayed marrying his fiancee for ten years and they struggled to live thereafter on his meager earnings Johann Peter never complained but instead relished being part of Goethe's life and assisting him And after Goethe passed though broken in health Eckermann labored continuously to create Conversations of Goethe I salute him for his total dedication to art both Goethe's and his own

Gespräche mit Goethe Epub Ê Gespräche mit  PDF \
  • Paperback
  • 1390 pages
  • Gespräche mit Goethe
  • Johann Peter Eckermann
  • German
  • 12 September 2016
  • 9783618680505